Questions for raw feeders

[Anna]

I'm sure the answers are on here in the archives but my search function is being wonky so I thought I'd ask the raw feeders on here:
1) I've been given conflicting advice on safety.  My vet says not to feed raw because it would be dangerous for Isaac and for me with my poor immune system.  But the people at Bones the raw food store say that they've never heard of anyone getting sick from their dog eating raw.  Any opinions on safety?
2) If we switch to raw do I need to do a weening process of some sort or just switch over food cold turkey?
3) are there any negatives to feeding raw that I should know of?

Thanks

[lmcpug]

Aw Anna!

I'm a total proponent for raw feeding but I'm sure
you knew that already:)

I just finished grinding and packaging enough
chicken for my gang to last till June!

1) immune compromise:  wash wash wash your hands
and anything else that touches the raw food.
Being extra vigilant is the best policy however does not
rule out infection, feeding raw is only something you will
have to decide on.  If you can be vigilante which I'm pretty
confident you can; then why not!!

2) as for transfer from pug to human after eating;
again wash wash wash! Wash their faces and if they
allow oral hygiene, brush their teeth and tongues.
        
3) weening?  I never weened my guys but again I never
Had the problems you are experiencing so will leave that one
For Blanche or Hilary. or any of the others, who do raw feeding.

4) negatives:  only one I had was with the 3 amigos! They had would
have an immediate. reaction to raw beef,  veal and goat
immediate upchucking, so allergies! other than that grains.

would you like me to search anything and send you the linkas??              
  
  
 
      
  
    
  
  
 

[Anna]

I think my biggest concern is about how lickie Darwin is with everyone, especially me and Isaac, and if that's dangerous with raw feeding.  To be honest tooth brushing for him after every meal is more than I can handle right now.

[lmcpug]

Do both Ada and Dar like carrots??

perhaps a couple carrots after feeding to
help them clean their mouth and then that
would only leave a face wash?!?.

There must be a safe way in which you can
do raw feeding?

I have only ever seen healthy results with
any Pug who starts raw.     
     
 
 

[Anna]

Yes they both like carrots, and get faces cleaned with baby wipes post meal as it is.  It would be great if I could get Darwin to drink too, his water consumption is awful!  Maybe one drink a day, no matter what I do.  Little bum.

[Sammers]

As you know Anna, Sami and Odie are fed raw, and I have no worries about it around JImmy. We do section off the kitchen as a no zone for Jimmy just incase, but we are very very careful with feeding it. (ie: never put raw food bowls in the sink with other dishes, clean the sink, counters when we are done their dinner). It can be done, but as you know, you have to be careful. We have been doing this almost a year, and no issues. I was hesitant too with a toddler, but all works well here.

[blanche]

This is one of the GREAT debates about raw fed dogs and there is at least one therapy dog organization that has banned raw fed dogs from participation due to the belief that raw fed dogs are dangerous to the immune compromised.

Here's an interesting article from the Whole Dog Journal on it.  Take from it what you will. Let me know if the whole article doesn't appear and I can try to copy and paste it.

http://www.whole-dog-journal.com/issues/13_7/features/Raw-Fed-Dogs_20025-1.html

[Sammers]

I went from feeding sami a home cooked concoction, and adding the raw with it, and pretty much insisting that she ate it. She did, and it may be a fluke - but her 9 months of UTI's disappeared, not saying that the raw did it, but I think it was definitely a help.

[blanche]

As you know Anna, Sami and Odie are fed raw, and I have no worries about it around JImmy. We do section off the kitchen as a no zone for Jimmy just incase, but we are very very careful with feeding it. (ie: never put raw food bowls in the sink with other dishes, clean the sink, counters when we are done their dinner). It can be done, but as you know, you have to be careful. We have been doing this almost a year, and no issues. I was hesitant too with a toddler, but all works well here.

The reality is that safe food handling practices are the issue, not the diet.  Do you wash your cutting board separately from other dishes?   It's about food handling WAY more than the diet, I think. 
The likelihood of catching salmonella from a cutting board used to cut up raw chicken to be cooked for dinner is likely higher than from getting licked by the dog.
Ultimately, Anna, it's a personal choice based on what you feel you can manage and what makes you feel works best for everyone.

[lmcpug]

So true!  careful handling of raw meat is the issue!
how you clean up is the deal!

even with myself I keep seperate cutting boards.
one set for veggies and breads and another set for
meats.
I also have one board that I use exclusively for
the processing of the pugs chicken. Wood!
It is salted and cleaned thoroughly b4 being stored!

I have yet to get sick nor anyone else who comes over.

 
   

   
   
 

[Sammers]

Yup, it's what you are comfortable with. In the end, I decided that Jimmy isn't near the kitchen any time, and Sami needed a change...I choose raw, it works for us.

[Anna]

I'm not too worried about food handling.  Nick was a kitchen manager at a restaurant so safe food handling practices are always enforced around here.  We would also be doing the ready made patties since I don't have time for homemade.  I guess my only real worry is whether Darwin could give Isaac or I Salmonella by licking us, as my vet implied.    Has anyone ever heard of anything like that happening?

[lmcpug]

 Never heard of that personally myself!

again, I would trust canine saliva over human
any day!
I've fed raw to Pugsley since hewas 6 and have
always touched him, given him kisses after
he finished eating and I have never been sick
from touching him! I'm pretty proactive with
being clean. however you can only be OCD about
cleanliness to a point!
We all need germs/bacteria in our daily lives; good or
bad! if you kill off 100% of the germs then our bodies/
immune systems will never be able to build immunities!
All these commercials/warnings about killing off bacteria
totally; is a catch 22!!
Up untill the late 80's or early 90's when all this
frenzy started about crucial cleanliness being a must;
most people were and still are healthy!
Mostly, people who have compromised immune systems
should be just one up on being proactive about cleanliness!

You haven't become ill yet by any raw meats in your
home yet?? and chances are, as much as we believe
our kitchens to be 95% sterilized after washing up;
it isnt!! what a black light would reveal would shock
all of us!  BACTERIA is a necessity for a healthy life!
(to a degree)      
    
My opinion;    try it! You can only try it!      
There is nothing to lose and everything to gain!

myself, Anna, would say, after all you've been through
with Dar and Ada........  they need a new health style. and
if they were mine, I would have them on raw diets toote suite!
BUT that is my opinion!!!
You and Nick need to decide on this matter yourselves.
You have all of us as back up; we are most definitely going
to. help and support anyone who wants to go RAW!
  
You need to search out and read all the postings on raw
Feeding! If you need help let me know and I will send the
Lins!

the above is just my opinion and 6 cents worth!!
 
 


  
      
    
  

 

[blanche]

 I guess my only real worry is whether Darwin could give Isaac or I Salmonella by licking us, as my vet implied.    Has anyone ever heard of anything like that happening?

No, i've never heard of it happening.  I hear alot of fear mongering about it and a lot of vets and others alleging that this can happen, but I've never heard of a documented case.

And if you look at the recalls on pet foods for salmonella, it is overwhelmingly kibble and treats.  IF there is a salmonella or e.coli danger that is so very prevalent, then why aren't we hearing about the risks of children handling kibble and dog treats?

Can I say for sure that there is absolutely no risk at all?  No, I can't.  Heck, you can get salmonella and e.coli from lettuce, strawberries and other veggies/fruits.  Do I feel that the risk is significant enough to warrant me NOT feeding raw?  No.  I honestly do believe that if there was a significant risk, I'd have gotten salmonella or e. coli by now from my dogs.  Lord knows I've been kissed in the mouth, nose and eyes enough to warrant infection if it were a substantial risk.

Here is an article on human infections of salmonella linked to their pets--NOTE that in all cases it was from purchased treats....

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5525a3.htm?s_cid=mm5525a3_e

[sherrys_own]

Please keep in mind this is my opinion and I'm not saying I'm right or wrong.  This is just the way I did it and for the record, I wouldn't buy any kibble for my gang here.  You can't give it to me, I just don't want it.

When I switched the gang here over, I did it within 24 hours.  I fasted my crew here and they didn't get ANY food at all for one day.  All they had was water.  Nothing else.  The next day, they got their pre made patties bought at the pet store.  No issues at all.  The only thing that I don't feed the crew here is chicken.  I have one pug that is allergic to chicken so they get everything else.

As for the "dangers" that the vet has told you.  In my opinion I don't believe it.  I wipe down the counter and wash my hands with antibacterial soap and that's it.  I don't wipe the dogs mouth at all.  They kiss me after all the time.  Have not had an issue at all.

I must say that I relied on Hilary and PM'd her my questions and she was great.  I thank her mostly for the help and in making me realize that I won't kill them with any feeding mistakes, just learn from them and relax.

Again, this is just my opinion.